• Research
  • Emissary
  • About
  • Experts
Carnegie Global logoCarnegie lettermark logo
DemocracyIran
  • Donate
Podcast Episode

Fixing Global Trade: Why Tariffs and Trade Wars Aren’t Enough

Sophia Besch sits down with Michael Pettis to talk about the failures of our modern global trading system and how to fix them.

Link Copied
By Sophia Besch and Michael Pettis
Published on Dec 5, 2024

Subscribe on

YoutubeSpotifyApple PodcastsOvercastPlayer FM

Our modern global trading system is broken. How can we fix it?

We seem to have moved beyond the free trade consensus of the globalization era. Few politicians today still publicly support the assumption that trade, unrestricted by national borders, makes everyone more prosperous. Under President Trump, the United States has wielded tariffs and industrial policy to reshape the international trade order to better serve American interests, and the Biden administration has upheld and doubled down on many of these. But these interventions do not yet add up to a new trade policy consensus.

This week's episode dives into a provocative new argument: in order to achieve freer trade, the world needs more trade interventions. What is global trade policy doing wrong? What new trade rules are needed to create a system that both harnesses the benefits of free trade and preserves nations' freedom to direct their economies? And what policy interventions might help foster this future of freer trade? Sophia discusses these questions and more with Michael Pettis, a nonresident Senior Fellow for Carnegie China and expert on China's economy.

  1. Michael Pettis and Erica Hogan, "Trade Intervention for Freer Trade," Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, October 3, 2024.

Hosted by

Sophia Besch
Senior Fellow, Europe Program
Sophia Besch

Featuring

Michael Pettis
Nonresident Senior Fellow, Carnegie China
Michael Pettis

Carnegie does not take institutional positions on public policy issues; the views represented herein are those of the author(s) and do not necessarily reflect the views of Carnegie, its staff, or its trustees.

More Work from The World Unpacked

  • Podcast Episode
    What to Know Before Trump Attacks Cuba

    Javier Corrales and host Jon Bateman discuss Cuba’s economic vulnerability, its political staying power, and why Trump might wind up making a deal with the Castros very similar to one made by Barack Obama. 

      • Jon Bateman

      Jon Bateman, Javier Corrales

  • Podcast Episode
    Can This Orb Kill AI Bots?

    Nick Pickles battled bots at Twitter and is now chief policy officer at Tools for Humanity, the Sam Altman-founded startup that reads eyeballs with an Orb. 


      • Jon Bateman
      • Nick Pickles

      Jon Bateman, Nick Pickles

  • Elon Musk
    Podcast Episode
    Elon Musk Is Reinventing Capitalism

    On this episode of The World Unpacked, authors Quinn Slobodian and Ben Tarnoff explore Musk’s historical meaning and debate the politics of technocracy with host Jon Bateman.

      • Jon Bateman

      Jon Bateman, Ben Tarnoff, Quinn Slobodian

  • Podcast Episode
    Why Orbán Lost and What Happens Next

    Tom Carothers, a top democracy scholar with deep ties in Hungary, joins Jon Bateman on a special episode of The World Unpacked.  

      • Jon Bateman

      Jon Bateman, Thomas Carothers

  • Podcast Episode
    Inside the Hidden World of Think Tanks

    Tino Cuellar is president of the Carnegie Endowment for International Peace, a premiere foreign policy think tank. He joins host Jon Bateman on The World Unpacked to pull back the curtain on this hidden world.

      • Jon Bateman

      Jon Bateman, Mariano-Florentino (Tino) Cuéllar

Get more news and analysis from
Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
Carnegie global logo, stacked
1779 Massachusetts Avenue NWWashington, DC, 20036-2103Phone: 202 483 7600
  • Research
  • Emissary
  • About
  • Experts
  • Donate
  • Programs
  • Events
  • Blogs
  • Podcasts
  • Contact
  • Annual Reports
  • Careers
  • Privacy
  • For Media
  • Government Resources
Get more news and analysis from
Carnegie Endowment for International Peace
© 2026 Carnegie Endowment for International Peace. All rights reserved.